This Bugzilla instance is a read-only archive of historic NetBeans bug reports. To report a bug in NetBeans please follow the project's instructions for reporting issues.

Bug 157588 - new sftp option for php in netbeans 7.0(RC) is very un-usable
Summary: new sftp option for php in netbeans 7.0(RC) is very un-usable
Status: RESOLVED DUPLICATE of bug 154446
Alias: None
Product: php
Classification: Unclassified
Component: FTP Support (show other bugs)
Version: 6.x
Hardware: All All
: P3 blocker (vote)
Assignee: Tomas Mysik
URL:
Keywords:
Depends on:
Blocks:
 
Reported: 2009-01-29 08:10 UTC by villalvilla
Modified: 2009-02-19 22:52 UTC (History)
0 users

See Also:
Issue Type: DEFECT
Exception Reporter:


Attachments

Note You need to log in before you can comment on or make changes to this bug.
Description villalvilla 2009-01-29 08:10:47 UTC
Hi all!
this is my first post on the list, so I will try to explain which is my
point of view about the new "sftp remote server" option in the release
candidate of the next version of netbeans.
I think that having to download ALL THE SOURCES from the remote sftp server
is JUST INACCEPTABLE! The point of view of having all the sources in a
remote server is just that! "Having all the sources in a remote server".
Think a little bit about this: if you have to download the sources to
mantain a remote development server, there will be a lot of problems during
synchonization, nor to mention the concatenated problems if you have a cvs
or a svn working copy on that server! As I told you: JUST INACCEPTABLE!

I have a very simple solution, that will make it so easy to develop! Have
you seen the solution that dreamweaver gives to this? they dont download all
the sources, they just download a directory list and the timestamp and file
identifiers of each file on the server! this is great, because if you have
to change any file on the server, you only download it, change it, and when
you save it, it uploads again to the server!
It's just simple and 100% functional!

Some of you could think about something: what about debugs with xDebug? it
needs the code, the clases and all that stuff...Wrong! xDebug runs on the
server machine and comunicates with the client through the 9000 port, and it
gives the client (in this case netbeans) all the information about the
execution of the php script on the server side! so it won't matter if
netbeans has all the source code for the scripts or not! it can just attach
the files it would need "on the fly".

Remember, this is only my opinion as netbeans user, but think about it,
please...
Regards
Comment 1 Tomas Mysik 2009-01-29 09:54:16 UTC
This was discussed on NB Users mailing list as follows. Anyway, marking as INCOMPLETE because it's not clear to me 
what the problem is.

My reaction:
---------- %< ----------
> Hi all!
> this is my first post on the list, so I will try to explain which is my
> point of view about the new "sftp remote server" option in the release
> candidate of the next version of netbeans.
> I think that having to download ALL THE SOURCES from the remote sftp server
> is JUST INACCEPTABLE! The point of view of having all the sources in a
> remote server is just that! "Having all the sources in a remote server".
> Think a little bit about this: if you have to download the sources to
> mantain a remote development server, there will be a lot of problems during
> synchonization, nor to mention the concatenated problems if you have a cvs
> or a svn working copy on that server! As I told you: JUST INACCEPTABLE!

I don't agree with you - this support is (mainly) for users who don't use any 
SCM at all (if you use any then your workflow is very likely different than 
just copying files using (S)FTP, you are probably using pull/push commands of 
your SCM).

> I have a very simple solution, that will make it so easy to develop! Have
> you seen the solution that dreamweaver gives to this? they dont download
> all the sources, they just download a directory list and the timestamp and
> file identifiers of each file on the server! this is great, because if you
> have to change any file on the server, you only download it, change it, and
> when you save it, it uploads again to the server!
> It's just simple and 100% functional!

NetBeans needs to "know" ale the sources (file contents) in order to provide 
editor features like code completion etc.

> Some of you could think about something: what about debugs with xDebug? it
> needs the code, the clases and all that stuff...Wrong! xDebug runs on the
> server machine and comunicates with the client through the 9000 port, and
> it gives the client (in this case netbeans) all the information about the
> execution of the php script on the server side! so it won't matter if
> netbeans has all the source code for the scripts or not! it can just attach
> the files it would need "on the fly".

Yes, Xdebug on a remote server is supported by NetBeans and it should work 
(please file an issue if not, thanks). As I wrote, source files are needed 
for editor features, not Xdebug.
---------- %< ----------

User's reaction:
---------- %< ----------
If it is a "deferred" method (I mean have all the sources on the sftp server), why does netbeans people call 
it "remote server"?
I mean: If your database is corporative for a lot of developers, your aproach with subversion won't work!
 If the only reason is code completion... I think that you shouldn't call it "remote server". Maybe netbeans could 
implement my aproach with something like a "code cache" to keep code completion working...
 I don't know, it's only a suggestion, but I think that if a developer on a remote sftp server looses it's own 
function, classes or variables suggestions, it won't be any problem compared with the problems that he/she would have 
with the aproach developed in the NB7(RC)...
---------- %< ----------

My reaction:
---------- %< ----------
> If it is a "deferred" method (I mean have all the sources on the sftp
> server), why does netbeans people call it "remote server"?

because it is a remote server (not locally installed web server)

> I mean: If your database is corporative for a lot of developers, your
> aproach with subversion won't work!

What do you mean by "corporative"? I don't understand what you mean exactly.

> If the only reason is code completion... I think that you shouldn't call it
> "remote server". Maybe netbeans could implement my aproach with something
> like a "code cache" to keep code completion working...
> I don't know, it's only a suggestion, but I think that if a developer on a
> remote sftp server looses it's own function, classes or variables
> suggestions, it won't be any problem compared with the problems that he/she
> would have with the aproach developed in the NB7(RC)...

In fact, I still don't fully understand what's the problem here. PHP project 
can be run as Local Web (1), Remote Web (2) or as a Script (3). Consider the 
following situations:
(1) you have local Apache, MySQL and PHP - so local web is suitable for you, 
you can develop without any problems; you have your own ways how to deliver 
your sources to the testing/production/whatever server or other team members 
(very likely using any SCM, of course); if you run a project (or file), just 
web browser is opened with the correct URL
(2) you don't have your local php, web server etc. (you don't want to install 
them probably) but you have account on a server - in this situation you can 
(but you don't have to, of course) use our _simple_ FTP/SFTP client to 
download/upload your sources from/to that server; if you run a project (or 
file), a dialog appears and offers you changed files to be uploaded to a 
server (this behaviour can be changed in Project Properties dialog) and web 
browser is opened with the correct URL (to a server); yes, it would be better 
to develop your PHP scripts directly on a remote server but this is not 
possible, reasons were written already
(3) you are developing just some script (e.g. for converting your old database 
schema to a new one) or console application, so just select Script Run 
Configuration (in Project Properties or directly during project creation); if 
you run a project (or file), just Output window is opened with the output of 
your script

All the information related to PHP support in NetBeans can be found here:
http://www.netbeans.org/features/php/
---------- %< ----------
Comment 2 Tomas Mysik 2009-02-18 15:33:34 UTC
No response from reporter for a long time so closing as WORKSFORME. Feel free to reopen and provide clarification what is wrong and
what should be fixed/improved and how. Thanks for reporting.
Comment 3 villalvilla 2009-02-18 19:33:04 UTC
Hi Tomas!
Sorry for the long time without posting nor answering you with my opinion on this issue.
If you remember, you told me:
> (Running a project on a remote Web Server) you don't have your local php, web server etc. (you don't want to install 
> them probably) but you have account on a server - in this situation you can 
> (but you don't have to, of course) use our _simple_ FTP/SFTP client to 
> download/upload your sources from/to that server; if you run a project (or 
> file), a dialog appears and offers you changed files to be uploaded to a 
> server (this behaviour can be changed in Project Properties dialog) and web 
> browser is opened with the correct URL (to a server); yes, it would be better 
> to develop your PHP scripts directly on a remote server but this is not 
> possible, reasons were written already.

I still don't understand your point of view. Why can't php scripts could be edited on the remote server directly?
Due to code suggestion issues? Come on, that's completely wrong! (from my point of view). Even, for that issue some
ideas could be implemented to bypass that code suggestion issues. For example, why not "mapping" server files during a
file edition to catch the dependencies between php files and the file that is being edited?
Or just don't suggest anything but php zend's ussual classes only in this case. If you think about this a little bit,
you will find this point of view too much usable than the concept implemented on netbeans today. Dreamweaver has this
such of thing implemented from it's 5 or 6 version and they are the most used program for web development.
If I tell you this, is because people REALLY uses this issue. Too much people develop web servers remotely, and with
your implementation you are keeping far and far away of those people.

Regards,
Miguel
Comment 4 Tomas Mysik 2009-02-18 21:11:30 UTC
reopening...
Comment 5 Tomas Mysik 2009-02-18 21:13:29 UTC
Thanks for clarification, now I understand what you mean. In such case it's duplicate of issue #154446 - look at it for more information.
Thanks for reporting.


*** This issue has been marked as a duplicate of 154446 ***